Church in a knot over gay marriage
Last updated at 13:52, Tuesday, 13 March 2012
Seems to me Roman Catholic cardinals, senior Anglican churchmen and obedient parish priests are getting themselves in a right old knot over the gay marriage issue.
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Bob, regarding your earlier comment, I think I can see what you're getting at now - in terms of "slippery slope". However, I still think the "step before it" argument is a valid one because whilst you say that I shouldn't oppose gay marriage on the grounds that it might lead to incestuous marriage, surely you can see that such an argument could always be wheeled out in defence of "the next step" every time it came up? In other words, if, for argument's sake, marriage is re-defined to include same-sex couples, and a few years afterwards there is a consultation on a further re-definition to include (say) marriage between uncles and nieces, would we then be having a variation on this argument where you'd be telling me I couldn't oppose it on the grounds that it might lead to a further re-definition to include brothers and sisters? And if, following that, there's a consultation on re-defining it to include brothers and sisters, will you then be telling me that I can't oppose it on the grounds that it might lead to the subsequent inclusion of parents and children? (and so on).If you still DO believe that it's not valid to object on the grounds of "the next step", are there ANY sorts of relationship between consenting adults of which you would NOT approve? If there is to be a line at all, where would you draw it?There must be plenty of similar examples of exclusions. I was wondering about joining Mensa. Apparently, you need an IQ of more than (I dunno!) 150 to get in. Surely someone could demand a re-definition of "high intelligence" to make it more inclusive on the grounds that it was discriminatory? If it were then reduced to (say) 100, wouldthat not invite a repeat of the process to (say) 75...and so on until it became absolutely meaningless?
But Bob, if one group of people don't have a "right" to keep the definition of marriage as it is, what gives another group of people the "right" to change it simply because it doesn't suit them as it is?
@Ian, just a quick one while I'm waiting for my son. Please excuse the terseness as I'm typing on a phone.
Your third point. "Not everything is a freedom", whilst true in some cases does not apply here. Being allowed to get married is a freedom that you and I can enjoy (I'm guessing) Why should it be a freedom for us but not for others? This is purely about definitions not immutable facts. No, you can't change your colour or ethnicity but we can, manifestly, change the definition of marriage hence the whole point of this conversation.
And no, I'm afraid I can't accept your last assertion as I don't accept your 'right' to keep marriage as it is. You are not in charge of the definition of marriage.